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  1. #16
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    Re: Rare Weapons & Armor

    Quote Originally Posted by Xeo View Post
    What really bums me out if that every person I know of on my server who has a top tier rare got it by waking up the following morning and checking to see what their macro "earned" for them the previous night. I only know of 1-2 top tiers, but they're both from people who macro exclusively when logged in.

    Really wish there were some way to make these available in a way that is super rare and difficult, while also not rewarding bad behavior at the same time.
    Xeo, I found mine 4-5 years ago while running Blackmire 2. There...now you know someone who didn't macro to get theirs.

  2. #17
    Registered User Vitae Boy's Avatar
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    Re: Rare Weapons & Armor

    ^^ I think Krunk has one that was found legitimately too. There's quite a few that have been found on MT, so making any kind of assertions based on the one or two you know were macroed is kinda silly IMO. Makes you sound like those folks that think anyone over 200 is a macroing fiend :\
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  3. #18
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    Re: Rare Weapons & Armor

    Quote Originally Posted by zuizide View Post
    Not mine, but I've seen it. PURE sickness for PvP imho. I told the guy it's too bad it's not on DT, but whomever uses it on FF will surely be abe to kill people within a few hits. I found it odd to be missing BD8 and Epic BT though. I suppose that would be just TOO powerful though PvP.

    Oddly enough this was used as a kitchen ladle before it was pressed into service as an atlatl. Apparently due to the ladle's resemblance to a serpent it was deemed inappropriate for use in the kitchen. After all serpents are synonymous with poison.

    Royal Ladle, work 0, +190% +18 MeleeD/+15 DMG, (Bael'Zharon's Hate, Cold Rending) Incantation of Swift Killer, Epic Cooking Prowess, Epic Thrown Aptitude, Incantation of Acid Protection Self, Incantation of Cooking Mastery Self, Incantation of Magic Resistance Self, Incantation of Defender, Value 50000, 500 BU

    Rare #252
    who owns that on FF??? is it SJ ?

  4. #19
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    Re: Rare Weapons & Armor

    Would dealing severely with UCM'ers....

    Hurt the game by upsetting them? Or help the game by making every one else happier?

  5. #20
    Registered User Chloe Noir's Avatar
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    Re: Rare Weapons & Armor

    I have never seen anything other then gems *CRY*
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  6. #21
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    Re: Rare Weapons & Armor

    More AC bigotry... sigh. When are you hate-mongers going to realize that trying to press your silly and boring way of playing on others will just hasten AC's death? The game is UCM/ACM-based, and has been for nigh on five years minimum, back when Turbine unofficially started supporting this playstyle by drastically reducing enforcement. They realized, like you should, that the game survives only because macros allow us to avoid AC's outdated timesink-heavy design, and thus continue playing without going nuts. Tradebots, buffbots, portal bots, combat bots, it's all the same, just some types suffer from being the targets of poorly justified pseudo-religious hatreds for little to no reason.

    The rare system was put in mainly for UCM/ACM players. I think this should be obvious based on its number-of-kills design. Restrict 'caught UCMers' to tier 1 and 2 rares? This kind of talk is akin to suggesting taking away voting rights from a cultural subgroup. i.e. completely unacceptable in modern society.

    I think the real problem is one of perception - this forum is dominated by pro-timesinkers, who all constantly insult players using a more effective playstyle, and who all agree with eachother in condescending ways. Pro-timesinkers have drawn a pseudo-religious line in the sand, and all tell eachother 'anyone who crosses this line is horrible!'... even though it's an arbitrary line, and so many lines before it were crossed by tradebots, buffbots, portal bots, craft bots etc ad infinitum. Do you remember 2000-2001 when there were people that considered spell-check macroing levels 1-20 in mana pools 'horribly amoral'? I can only foresee the current line being crossed by AC's population in the interest of actually wanting to experience content instead of grind, and another line being drawn a little further past in the sand. 'Now don't cross THAT line, or you're horrible!'

    If we had more pro-efficiency players on here espousing their views, the atmosphere might be a little less 'prejudiced'. Unfortunately, we can't, because they're all out actually living their lives instead of grinding away on a 10 year old game.

    So, yeah, let's not restrict people's rares because of random prejudices.

  7. #22
    Registered User Brukid's Avatar
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    Re: Rare Weapons & Armor

    Dear meridian,

    There are many points in your argument that I agree with. While personally I hate macroing, I completely understand and accept why other players love it. A person could wake up one morning, spend an hour setting up his character in a dungeon and leaving for work, returning hours later to find his character several levels more powerful and with a pack full of salvage (and for the sake of remaining on-topic...a rare item!)

    I would, however, like to inform you on why us "macro-haters" feel the way we do......or atleast why I do. In 2000, when Asheron's Call was in its prime, I was only 4 years old. Every night, I would walk downstairs to my dad's study and hope very much that he was playing AC. Most of the time, he was. I would stand behind him, watching him explore this AMAZING world swarming with players and adventure. At that time, everywhere you went was a discovery.

    I remember the subway, overflowing with players. I remember the lifestones some time later being surrounded by hungry patrons, craving for a vassal. I REMEMBER the characters who are now-a-days monarchs of large allegiances.

    For me personally (again, I don't know if I can speak for others), the reason I dislike macroing is because when I play Asherons Call now in 2010, I try to relive my memories. I run through the barren parts of the world for 30 minutes simply to find that "old dungeon that I remember so well". People like myself feel that if there were no UCMers, then the past could be re-lived.

    This is only a belief, and I am fully aware that it is impossible to replicate the years of AC's prime. It is not impossible, however, to create new memories and experiences, which has however become very difficult due to the majority of players leveling their characters through macros.

    I hope that I have done atleast a semi-decent job describing to you the opposite view-point of this subject.

    Best regards,
    ~ Bru

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~ Bru ~~~~~~~~~~~~
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  8. #23
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    Re: Rare Weapons & Armor

    Wow, great post. It's nice to see someone with a positive reason for their stance. I feel the same way about the game, and wish that it was overflowing with tons of people again.

    Still, are macros to blame? If macros weren't used, wouldn't the game just be gone completely? I think it's the world that's changed. The amount of timesinking people will put up with to experience content has gone far down, and the quality of that content demanded has gone up. So I don't believe there is any way for us to get low and mid level content filled again.

    Sometimes I go back to Shoushi Grotto to relive my first days in AC a decade ago, when I would spend hours killing one monster at time, taking a minute or two each time, and then lying down to regen. At that rate I managed a level a day, and thought it was fantastic. Then again, I also only knew that tiny 0.01% of the game. Shoushi Grotto was filled with little details that inspired my imagination. Doors opened by levers, bookcases, jail areas, even a stone throne with loot behind it. Surely, this MUD-like level of detail would only get better as the game progressed. The rest of the game must be a thriving, living, energetic world full of mystery...!

    But now I go back to Shoushi Grotto and I see 'trash monsters not worth my time', I see that it takes 37 seconds to run to the back, I see that none of the items are worth looting. Shoushi Grotto is... just a space now. A space with nothing useful to me in it. Shoushi Grotto is exactly the same, but I have changed. Like real life, we've all grown up, and the excitement and inspiration of ignorance is gone. Now we play to min-max, to win, to finish as fast as possible, and the innocence of a decade ago is gone forever like an adult trying to play with a kid's toy, I think sadly most people can't even understand why it used to be fun to do such pointless things.

  9. #24
    Registered User Taomagicdragon_SC's Avatar
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    Re: Rare Weapons & Armor

    Quote Originally Posted by Xeo View Post
    I certainly can't say that EVERYONE who has a top tier rare is a macroer, but a regular player having one would be the exception to the norm at the moment.

    If the game had more of a population and could afford to lose subscriptions, I would request that anyone who has ever failed a UCM test be restricted to only finding tier 1 and 2 rares.

    I'm realistic enough to know that they'd never implement a change like that though, even if they wanted to.
    I'd enjoy that.

    Also, to add another to your regular list, I own a few high tier rares.
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  10. #25
    Registered User Gengis's Avatar
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    Re: Rare Weapons & Armor

    I think they inadvertently made moves towards that end Xeo when they put in the real-time rare timer. Whether you kill 1,000,000 critters or a few, every toon will see a rare every few months. That was a nice add in for casual players and non-UCMers.

    I'd like to see something like that expanded upon. The Mukkir quest is it that gives a random rare in the chest? If they had more quests that gave random rares, it would even the playing field some.

    A UCMer gets several rares a night. Why can't a questing player get several rares a day?
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  11. #26
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    Re: Rare Weapons & Armor

    Quite frankly, (and I think Turbine has been up front about this) there's no content being put in specifically for non-UCMers because they aren't a group, anymore than there are financial laws being put in for 'people who waste money'. The pro-timesinking crowd is really just a collection of people handicapping themselves for arbitrary reasons, then clamoring that everyone should waste time like they do. They're not an actual demographic.

    I think alot of the misunderstanding comes from things like Aetheria nerfs. The problem, as Turbine stated, was not that 'macros' (i.e. most everyone) got Aetheria at a higher rate than pro-timesinkers. It's that the rate they provided MFKs was simply too high in and of itself. Notice that normal people still get way more Aetheria-MMDs than pro-timesinkers. The only thing that changed was the absolute rate of MFK production, regardless of source. However, pro-timesinkers interpret this as some sort of pro-timesinker agenda from Turbine, when it's really not.

  12. #27
    Registered User Gengis's Avatar
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    Re: Rare Weapons & Armor

    Quote Originally Posted by meridian59gar View Post
    Quite frankly, (and I think Turbine has been up front about this) there's no content being put in specifically for non-UCMers because they aren't a group, anymore than there are financial laws being put in for 'people who waste money'. The pro-timesinking crowd is really just a collection of people handicapping themselves for arbitrary reasons, then clamoring that everyone should waste time like they do. They're not an actual demographic.

    I think alot of the misunderstanding comes from things like Aetheria nerfs. The problem, as Turbine stated, was not that 'macros' (i.e. most everyone) got Aetheria at a higher rate than pro-timesinkers. It's that the rate they provided MFKs was simply too high in and of itself. Notice that normal people still get way more Aetheria-MMDs than pro-timesinkers. The only thing that changed was the absolute rate of MFK production, regardless of source. However, pro-timesinkers interpret this as some sort of pro-timesinker agenda from Turbine, when it's really not.
    Not really. The aetheria nerf was due to the fact that sub 150s had more access to MFK loot than was intended. They still drop, they can still be macroed, but they convert to MMDs now.
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  13. #28
    Registered User Taomagicdragon_SC's Avatar
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    Re: Rare Weapons & Armor

    Quote Originally Posted by Gengis View Post
    Not really. The aetheria nerf was due to the fact that sub 150s had more access to MFK loot than was intended. They still drop, they can still be macroed, but they convert to MMDs now.
    I think you both just said the same thing.
    First member of the Whispering Blade
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  14. #29
    Registered User Gengis's Avatar
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    Re: Rare Weapons & Armor

    Quote Originally Posted by Taomagicdragon_SC View Post
    I think you both just said the same thing.
    Close, very close. There is a difference between adjusting the MFK rate for Aetheria and removing the conversion of Aether to MFKs on certain types. The root of the change wasn't the rate, it was the levels accessing the MFKs.
    .
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    [General] +Turbine Noworries says, "Yes your creepy man love for Sev on the forums put you in the no go list Gengis"

    Asheron's Call is experiencing a renaissance period! Nice work Devs!

    Strong supporter of REP ME (Race Elaboration Proposals and Mite Expansion)

  15. #30
    Registered User Taomagicdragon_SC's Avatar
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    Re: Rare Weapons & Armor

    Quote Originally Posted by Gengis View Post
    Close, very close. There is a difference between adjusting the MFK rate for Aetheria and removing the conversion of Aether to MFKs on certain types. The root of the change wasn't the rate, it was the levels accessing the MFKs.
    Yeah, I see that the latter results in the former and it does both
    First member of the Whispering Blade
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